[*BCM*] Bike Law.

[Jim Leonard]

nevele:

You're pushing that new laws should be put into place for cyclists in this
message and others (and being much of a jerk about how you're saying it
too, but this is the last time I'm going to bring this up).  My concern is
that you say you think something should be changed because it's a) more
convenient for cyclists in almost all cases and b) it's safer for cyclists
in these specific special cases.  What you're failing to point out is that
in many other specific cases it can become far more dangerous.

In regards to running red lights.  I will agree that if you know the
intersection well and have perfect visibility for all potential incoming
traffic then yes, running the light when traffic is clear provides
significant safety in that you aren't dealing with getting up to speed
with auto traffic doing the same all while the space becomes much narrowed
by the end of the intersection with cars parked on the right and opposing
traffic waiting to make a left as far left as possible and often even to
the left of center.  By being ahead of the auto traffic you force the
autos to pass you at a much safer time.  However the two ifs I stated are
pretty big ifs that only apply part of the time.  The law should apply all
of the time with maybe a few well noted (and marked) exceptions.  I should
not have to read a sign saying which of 30 laws I'm supposed to follow at
each intersection (or worse, know which of 30 laws I'm supposed to follow
at each intersection which is why a well written law that has or makes
specific exceptions requires that there be good signage around the
exceptions) A safer alternative imho (and within existing law) is to queue
up with cars waiting at a light and take your lane through the
intersection and let the autos pass once you're through.  As to the
intersection you're describing, if it's the one I think it is, it's a
dangerous intersection for cars too and should be reworked.  The problem
is that if it were to actually be made safe, it would either take redoing
the area around the intersection which would be prohibitively expensive or
it would drastically reduce traffic throughput which people who drive
through there every day would not put up with so the city is kind of stuck
(one intersection isn't going to change much but if the city/state made a
policy of making the roads safe at the expense of significant reduction of
auto traffic thoughput, the current voting population would throw them out
at the earliest convenience or sooner.

Regarding giving your name and address to an officer, per MGL yes you do
have to give the (correct) information if asked.  The officer can't
require ID (in this state, but that's not the case in others and has been
upheld in federal courts).  Failure to provide this information will turn
a ticketable offence into an arrestable offence.  The requesting officer
does have to have reason to ask but you're only legally allowed to
question an officer's demands in court after the fact, not while the
officer is making his demands.

your other two laws, I have less to comment on.  I don't know whether
state or local ordinances take precedence for traffic laws in this state
(In some states like NY it depends on the size of the city making the
laws!).  But I will say that passing on the right is dangerous and in
general the law gives you a significant leeway to avoid immediate
dangerous situations.

--jim

On Sat, 7 Apr 2007, . nevele wrote:

> i'd like to note that a few of the laws listed at massbike.com are from t=
he
> boston transportation department. the first - and hopefully last - time i
> was doored it was by a BTD car. so they can suck my balls. "Do not cross
> stop line when traffic signal is red." -BTD. i'm pretty good about that..
> but when you're on a bike you've got a shit-ton more visability than anyo=
ne
> in a car and as a matter of survival have a better idea of everything els=
e
> around you. at red lights i stop, i look around, and i go if it's an opti=
on.
> most of the time it actually works out to be safer that way. example: the
> light by the Model where brighton ave splits off in to cambridge st. and =
no.
> beacon. i take no. beacon.. if i were to wait for the light to turn green=
,
> i'd be in the way of merging traffic when it does. that's NOT my safest b=
et.
> i also check side mirrors before opening doors when i happen to be in a
> car..
>
> "Ride on the right side of the road, with the flow of traffic." -BTD agai=
n.
> this completely contradicts MGL. you ride on the right side of the road w=
hen
> traffic is moving faster than you, you move over to the left when it's no=
t.
>
> "Do not pass on the right of cars turning right." -random. yea, because
> drivers are always so damn astute that they always use turn signals. no. =
for
> someone who is experienced in riding in the city it's easy to tell when a
> car is about to turn if they're not using their signal.. for someone who
> isn't it's a dangerous situation.
>
> "You must give your name and address when asked by a police officer." -MG=
L.
> Ohhhh really!? i'm pretty sure we're not living in 1984 just yet. there's
> more to that law that massbike didn't mention. look it up.
>
> my point??
>
> we need a new set of laws for cyclists that actually makes sense. there's=
 NO
> point in taking the local driver's test and trying to apply that to peopl=
e
> riding bikes. "Two wheels or four, the law is the same."   uhhh, no. no i=
t
> isn't. it's a completely different situation for cyclists. we need to be
> taken seriously by motorists, but that doesn't mean that we need to follo=
w
> the same laws that they don't even follow half of the time, particularly
> when said laws put us in harms way.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: "David Watson" <david at massbike.org>
> >Reply-To: Boston Critical Mass <list at bostoncriticalmass.org>
> >To: "Boston Critical Mass" <list at bostoncriticalmass.org>
> >Subject: RE: [*BCM*] List of dangerous streets
> >Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 13:01:22 -0400
> >
> >MassBike does in fact offer classes on how to ride safely in traffic; mo=
re
> >than 200 people signed up last year.  We're putting together the spring
> >schedule now, and revamping our curriculum a bit, but the info will be u=
p
> >soon at http://www.massbike.org/skills/classes.htm.  We also have some t=
ips
> >online at http://www.massbike.org/skills/traffic.htm.  We've also got a
> >pamphlet online that looks at the law from both a bicyclist and motorist
> >perspective: http://www.massbike.org/info/roadhog.pdf.  One of the goals=
 of
> >the Bicyclist Safety Bill is to make the law even more clear about how c=
ars
> >should interact with bikes.
> >
> >-David
> >   -----Original Message-----
> >   From: bostoncriticalmass-bounces at bostoncriticalmass.org
> >[mailto:bostoncriticalmass-bounces at bostoncriticalmass.org]On Behalf Of
> >Andrew Toomajian
> >   Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 11:31 AM
> >   To: Boston Critical Mass
> >   Subject: RE: [*BCM*] List of dangerous streets
> >
> >
> >   I think it might be more productive to focus on "best" routes rather
> >than
> >which streets are dangerous and why.  The SF Bike coalition, for example=
,
> >makes a map of bike routes through the city avoiding it's major hills.  =
It
> >would be a great project to do this for Boston, with the goal of avoidin=
g
> >areas of especially high traffic, severely pot-holed roads, etc.
> >
> >   Me and the sweetie were talking about this last night - does anyone
> >offer
> >classes or guidelines on how to ride safely in traffic?  This might be a
> >great project for MassBike, and I bet there is grant money for it
> >somewhere.
> >A lot of it boils down to "when in doubt - take the lane" but I'm sure
> >there
> >could and would be more to it than that.  The sweetie has done a lot les=
s
> >city riding than me so she ends up asking me for survival tips a lot.  I
> >bet
> >a lot of people are in a similar situation and a well promoted class wou=
ld
> >help avoid accidents like this one.
> >
> >
> >   >
> >   > Maybe Massbike could compile a list of known, dangerous streets for
> >   > bicyclist to avoid, or at least be aware of. That would be the best
> >help
> >   > they could give for now. We have a wealth of knowledge here that ne=
eds
> >to
> >   > be dispersed before another tragedy occurs. I took Massbike's safe
> >biking
> >   > course but found their insistence that city biking is safe a little
> >   > detached from reality. Bicycle safety is not as simple or easy as
> >   > following a few road rules. Not acknowledging this is very
> >irresponsible.
> >   > We don't need to let another person to find out the hard way which
> >   > streets are unsafe.
> >   >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------=
----
> >--
> >   It=92s tax season, make sure to follow these few simple tips Check it=
 out!
>
>
> >_______________________________________________
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> >list at bostoncriticalmass.org
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