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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>I, and I’m
sure anyone here, can cite plenty of times when the law was violated in a way
that inconvenienced, annoyed, or put us or others in peril. I could form a
list just from the way to work this morning. In <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Britain</st1:place></st1:country-region>, we have speed cameras all
over the place, and they get everyone over a certain speed. It is very
consistent enforcement, raises revenue and also costs a lot less than police on
the street having to stop people, block more traffic and write tickets. There’s
also evidence that since they came in, people do in fact speed less as they’re
much more likely to get caught.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>People *<b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>hate</span></b>* speed cameras. Though I know a
friend who’s terribly proud of getting a speeding ticket from one of them
while on his bike in <st1:place w:st="on">Hong Kong</st1:place>, but I digress.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>There are also
many cameras at intersections to prevent people running red lights. Although
there’s less of them now than there used to be as there is less need.
Since people know they’re going to be caught, they don’t run the
lights. Consistent enforcement by an always present monitor. People hate
those cameras too.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>The cold hard
fact of the matter is that people hate getting caught. “It is ok when I
do it because I’m safer/know what I’m doing/took all the right
precautions/am a better driver or cyclist or pedestrian than everyone else”
and of course the perpetual favourite “well, it is just a stupid law
anyway.” <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>If you want the
really consistent enforcement, you’ve got to find a way to have it, and
that means lots more cops. Or at least lots more traffic cops. I have yet to
find anyone who wants to pay for more cops, but many people want to have more.
Was there a cop around when this woman put her baby’s stroller in the bike
lane? Will you care if you are busted for a traffic violation despite the fact
that your “riding style reflects that kind of chaos?” <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'>There are points
where you decide to be part of the problem or part of the solution. What the
solution is can vary considerably. People on here urged Thom to lead a
campaign against double parked cars, and then they would follow. As he then
rightly pointed out, you don’t need him to lead a campaign, you need to
get off your backside and lead/make/create your own campaign. He even gave you
the resources to do it. But I haven’t seen anyone say “Thanks man,
what a great idea, I’ll start doing just that.” Complaining to
like minded-ish individuals, pouting and being in a bad mood about it all is
one thing. Actually doing something about it is another. And whichever you
choose, I feel confident that you’ll get the justice you’ve earned
in the long run.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face="Book Antiqua"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Book Antiqua";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
bostoncriticalmass-bounces@bostoncriticalmass.org
[mailto:bostoncriticalmass-bounces@bostoncriticalmass.org] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Rob Arnold<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 06 March 2008 23:45<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Boston
Critical Mass</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [*BCM*] dbl parked</span></font><span
lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>I think you're all
misinterpreting my main point, which is that enforcement needs to be equal and
consistent across an entire range of traffic: from motor vehicles on down to
pedestrians. Once, I had to dodge into traffic because of a lady who stood on a
corner in <st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">Central Square</st1:address></st1:Street>,
with her stroller sitting completely in the bike lane. In the bike lane!!! Her
baby! In the bike lane!! That woman needs to be cited far more than the
original poster does. And, sadly, it's not atypical behavior in
Cambridge/Boston/Somerville/etc. It's a cascading set of factors that creates
chaos, and my riding style reflects that kind of chaos. I ride down the center
stripe on Mass Ave through Central Square because I'm further away from
double-parked cars, and further away from jaywalkers, and further away from
hazardous debris that gets pushed over to the road edges, and outside the path
of cars turning right without looking. If the lanes designated for me, as a
cyclist, are not sufficiently safe due to a general failure on the part of
Cambridge Police to enforce other traffic laws, you bet I'm going to say
something when I have the immediate ear of a traffic officer.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Thu, Mar 6, 2008 at 6:13 PM, Hiroyuki Yamada <<a
href="mailto:hyamada@mit.edu">hyamada@mit.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>I think, for the purpose of the discussion at hand, (correct me if I am<br>
mistaken) the definition of "wrong," in Thom3's original comment, is<br>
simply an infraction of the law. Regardless of the somewhat questionable<br>
nature of "wrong" vs "right," which inherently bring into
view a<br>
significantly more clouded discussion, the legality of a certain action<br>
is much simpler to determine. And in this case, the running of the red<br>
light is, in essence, wrong. The fact that another guy over there is<br>
double parked, that another car is driving in a non-existent lane, that<br>
someone just drove through the (now) green light going 5 miles over the<br>
speed limit, all of these have no bearing on the fact that running the<br>
red light was wrong to begin with, and the other crimes are not excuse<br>
for the cyclist to get off easy. If anything, all 4 should be punished<br>
to the severity that the crime warrants, with no externalities<br>
introduced from neighboring crimes.<br>
<br>
When you're dealing with the police, more often than not, "zee rules are<br>
zee rules" is about as far as you can get; they're probably not too<br>
interested in debating moral philosophy, or even legislative intent, and<br>
would probably just like to get on with their day. (Granted, some police<br>
officers may be over-zealous in their interpretation of certain laws<br>
against others (leading to racism and other forms of bias), but that<br>
again is a separate issue.)<br>
<br>
--Yuki<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
John Hays wrote:<br>
> I tend to agree that people trot out "two wrongs don't make a
right" in<br>
> situations where it basically amounts to a non-sequitur, largely on the<br>
> basis that it's relevance assumes something being contested (that some<br>
> action in question is in fact a wrong). I will say that it's not<br>
> particularly clear to me that riding through an intersection under those<br>
> circumstances is, in any meaningful sense, a wrong. It may very well be<br>
> that it's _against the law_ to do that, but that's just another<br>
> non-sequitur, since the fact that something is against the law is not<br>
> evidence of it being wrong. I shudder to think how many people (even on<br>
> this list) actually believe that "zee rules are zee rules" is a<br>
> sufficient justification for the deliberate infliction of suffering upon<br>
> or deprivation of material assets from a person.<br>
><br>
> - John<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Jym Dyer wrote:<br>
><br>
>>>>> 2 wrongs don't make a right.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>> =v= Ain't it wonderful how this particular topic always<br>
>>>> brings out fresh, invigorating new insights?<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>> And just what are your fresh insights?<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>> =v= Here's a tip: When you find yourself regurgitating the<br>
>> world's most obvious clichés for the umpteenth time, as if<br>
>> the person you're responding to is a blithering idiot, you<br>
>> are wasting your time (and the time of everyone else who<br>
>> might be wearing of a cliché-filled inbox). Perhaps the<br>
>> person really is a blithering idiot, in which case your<br>
>> words are useless; but what's more likely is that you're<br>
>> not attempting to understand what the person is getting<br>
>> at, in which case your communication is pointless.<br>
>> <_Jym_><br>
>><br>
>> _______________________________________________<br>
>> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Boston Critical Mass</st1:PersonName>
mailing list<br>
>> <a href="mailto:list@bostoncriticalmass.org">list@bostoncriticalmass.org</a><br>
>> <a href="http://bostoncriticalmass.org/list" target="_blank">http://bostoncriticalmass.org/list</a><br>
>> To unsubscribe email <a
href="mailto:list-unsubscribe@bostoncriticalmass.org">list-unsubscribe@bostoncriticalmass.org</a><br>
>><br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
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